Date of meeting: 28 September 2021
Minutes
Item 1 – Welcome and introductions
The Chair welcomed members, and new members to the Panel and provided an overview of the agenda for the meeting.
The new members provided a brief introduction on their background and what they will look to contribute to the Panel.
Act: Secretariat to collate and share with new members the bios of current Panel members.
Item 2 - UK Finance Payments Standards Strategy Group (PSSG) Final Report and Recommendations – update and discussion
(Jana MacKintosh and Austin Elwood of UK Finance joined the meeting for this item)
UK Finance provided an overview of the scope and recommendations in the Final PSSG report, and noted the driver for UK Finance is to ensure a collaborative standards environment in the UK. UK Finance noted it is working closely with Pay.UK on the Enhanced Fraud Data use case. The proposed Payments Standards Engagement Forum (PSEF) will be a strategic and forward-looking body not just about ISO 20022, but will look a wider range of topics including Digital Identification and CBDC.
UK Finance note the feedback from its members has been a need for a formation of a central standards body, but without replacing the existing governance and approval on standards. Members thought UK Finance is best placed to be this central body, to move the standards dialogue forward and drive the benefits of standards and additional data. UK Finance mentioned it is not looking to enforce or set standards but would like to convene a group with the right representation from industry to solve current issues, such as Economic Crime.
The Panel opined that the right experts e.g. Financial Crime experts, need to lead and help this work to drive and support it going forward.
A member of the Panel raised concerns on whether too much time is spent on use cases at the risk of postponing development for current programmes such as the Bank’s RT2, or the NPA. Some Panel members were also concerned about the risk that the Bank may be ready for additional data but Pay.UK will not. The Panel advised there needs to be the right balance and a pragmatic approach taken. It was agreed roles for the Panel and the SEF need to be defined and coordinated, and scope of each group determined. Act: Further discussion on the roles, scope and terms of reference of the SEF and the Panel, Secretariat to schedule a further discussion on this as early as possible to continue dialogue.
UK Finance noted the fraud use case is undergoing a Proof of Concept taking historical data (based on five existing data points) and seeking to understand, through data analytics, how much fraud could have been mitigated if this data had been available. They are looking to have this completed by year end. In the coming months, Pay.UK will work with industry to determine the standardisation process and work towards developing a pragmatic solution.
The Panel also noted it would be beneficial to map the terms of reference of the SAP to that of the PSEF, and understand the difference between the two and whether there is any duplication. UK Finance noted it is working through the terms of reference for the PSEF over the coming months.
The Bank noted the strength of the Panel is its end user representation, an important consideration for the setup of the PSEF. Pay.UK noted there are two things we need the Panel’s help with: 1. Standardisation work – are we using the right data; 2. What degree will it help in the implementation of both the RT2 and NPA Programmes, how do we as an enabler help the industry utilise these standards – what can be done now?
The Panel noted we need to challenge ourselves on the need for a standard, or whether it is best to leave it to industry to innovate and provide competitive solutions. The right balance needs to be found in maximising competition but not to stifle innovation in the industry.
Item 3 - Pay.UK Standards End-to-End Use Cases for the NPA – update and discussion
Pay.UK provided an update on the work progressing on its standards end-to-end uses, noting this is an important piece of work that Pay.UK is working on with HMRC, the Bank and Open Banking. Pay.UK noted it has identified c.30 use cases the NPA can enable, and additional resources will help drive this work forward. However, the three primary use cases presented will be run now for the current services, but with a clear adoption lens to the NPA. Pay.UK noted it would like the Panel to help and challenge the detail and requirements of this work.
The Panel was asked for views on how far out in the ecosystem could Pay.UK be in terms of setting effective standards, noting Pay.UK does not currently have the powers to set standards outside of the Clearing and Settlement layer. The Panel noted it had understood that Pay.UK did have enforcement powers as retail operator in the UK (above and beyond Clearing and Settlement) and queried where this would reside in the ecosystem otherwise. Pay.UK noted it is more about influencing the end user, and would like to work with the Panel to get this right to avoid what happened in Europe with SEPA.
Pay.UK mentioned the first use case will test commitment from industry to play its part in ensuring standards beyond Clearing and Settlement can be effective, as well as help determine requirements. Pay.UK requested the Panel’s commitment to help shape this work going forward, whether it is the right approach, or if there are alternatives.
Item 4 – Any other business
The Panel Chair gave a special thanks to a member of the Panel Secretariat who will be leaving the Secretariat to a new role. Act: Due to the meeting running overtime, the last agenda item on the ‘Forward Direction of the Panel’ will be added as the first agenda item at the next Panel meeting.
Close of meeting.
Attendees
[NB all by Zoom videoconference]
Members
Karen Braithwaite, Chair (Barclays)
Robert White, Santander
Brendan Reilly, Silicon Valley Bank
James Barclay, JP Morgan
Domenico Scaffidi, Volante
Ralf Ohlhausen, PPRO
James Whittle, Pay.UK
James Southgate, Bank of England
Jo Oxley, Government Banking Service
Toby Young, Ebury
Margaret Walsh, Oracle
Caroline Stockmann, Association of Corporate Treasurers
Mike Walters, Form3
Observers
Ian Ellis, Payment Systems Regulator
Other attendees
Bank of England & Pay.UK Secretariat
Bank of England & Pay.UK Presenters
Jana MacKintosh (Item 2), UK Finance
Austin Elwood (Item 2), UK Finance
Apologies
Oli Bogaerts, FCA